BristolBear wrote:

Really sums up the state of English spin bowling if we do go back to Moeen though.

Certainly does. The idea of division two Dom Bess coming back in doesn't fill me with too much confidence. I'd go Moeen and Rehan and see who's most suitable on a test by test basis

I think they'll certainly sound Moeen out about potentially making himself available for the first couple of tests at least for the squad and be available if conditions suit a particular attack

They might then use the extra month or so of time to prepare one of the youngsters for Old Trafford

Playing so late seems to me to negate the advantage gained in having a fixture on a weekend day. Surely there need not be such a long gap between the Double header games 2pm and 5pm would've been preferable to me.

Crowd couldn't have been much above 8 or 9,000 although the actual members section in front of the Dollery bar looked fuller than for the Blast off fixture much more sparse elsewhere

I may be completely wrong but I doubt that's it for Woakes. He's likely being wrapped in cotton wool just in case Jimmy pulls up or cannot get through two tests in a row. He's played two CC games Vs Surrey and Hants did fine in both and they're far better opposition than Ireland so doubt he needs this 'test' to prove anything to anyone. His role is very decent back-up for Jimmy Broad Robinson

Good luck to Josh Tongue who if he does well will be another option for England perhaps 4th or 5th test if the injuries rack up in the early part of the series

LeicesterExile wrote:

mad wrote:

realcounties.org.uk

I'm sure you'll be aware of this campaign bosworth. It is interesting the way county identity has slipped in the much of the UK in a way that hasn't been the case in for example Ireland. Ireland has done a better job of retaining county identities in the contemporary age where in Britain people are far more likely to identify with their city or town. Britain being more of an urban metropolitan country these days with vast suburbs housing two thirds of the population. Similar to the USA and Australia post 1950's prior to which even in America there was far clearer distinction between town and country

Interesting point of view. However, the problem is we have a cricket club called Warwickshire putting out a team called Birmingham. Perhaps what is needed is for one or two teams to change their name. Warwickshire becomes Greater Birmingham and likewise Lancashire becomes Greater Manchester. Surrey could become South London, Middlesex North London.

I certainly wouldn't want any of that. We just have to see the motivation at play here. Warwickshire because they have a big ground and a recent (post 1980's) record of success overall either 1st or 2nd most successful county side in that period, see themselves as a big county up with Yorkshire Lancs and Surrey. The next generation of cricket fan available to a club based in what was at least up until the commonwealth games a rather unppealing/uninviting inner city area of South Biimingham (particularly during rush hour and late evening) may not identify with Warwickshire as a real place (other than when they did English civil war history topic at school). To get the locals to take notice of the club it was thought required a complete overhaul. I do however think now the precinct around the stadium coupled with decent public transport options (pretty please) and the long overdue installation of cycle lanes separated from the main highway and a slight fall in rush hour traffic particularly on Fridays makes it more appealing for visitors so they can have confidence reverting to the historic and famous name

Edgbaston is a similar walking or taxi distance from the centre of Brum as the Oval is from Charing Cross Station so could in theory be able to draw in that type of crowd perhaps not midweek however

realcounties.org.uk

I'm sure you'll be aware of this campaign bosworth. It is interesting the way county identity has slipped in the much of the UK in a way that hasn't been the case in for example Ireland. Ireland has done a better job of retaining county identities in the contemporary age where in Britain people are far more likely to identify with their city or town. Britain being more of an urban metropolitan country these days with vast suburbs housing two thirds of the population. Similar to the USA and Australia post 1950's prior to which even in America there was far clearer distinction between town and country

On the name of the Blast team I'm willing to give the club some slack at this point. I do think traditional members like the traditional name in all formats and that's very valid and concerns are real - it does look daft when seeing the tables just as it looked daft seeing Glamorgan when they were called 'Wales'. However I can understand it from the club's point of view also. The term Warwickshire seems to have less resonance today within the city itself than it did 30 years ago. I very much doubt many kids learn at school that Brum was even part of Warwickshire. I think the club and the city council want Birmingham to have that same gravitas that Manchester has for quite some time now in the north west - that same allure especially given how fantastic the city can show itself to be. Manchester doesn't seem to get the same kind of negative attitude towards it from neighbouring boroughs like Bury and Bolton that Brum used to from Black Country folk and dormitory towns in the shires. Same is true of London and its relationship to other parts of the South East it seems more symbiotic rather than tribal. Maybe this is reducing over time too and youngsters in Sandwell and Dudley etc and dormitory towns like Lichfield and Bromsgrove... now find it very comfortable identifying with the idea that they live and work in an area that could easily be called 'Greater Birmingham' and they'd be happy about that fact in a way that previous generations of Black Country folk would rail against.

In a round about way what I'm getting at is the club seems to have explored ways to widen it's reach within the wider West Midlands conurbation and that has led them to adopting Birmingham or simply 'Bears' as a name reflecting that a significant proportion of the club's potential fanbase are not based in Warwickshire or have any real sense of the county as an entity. Whether the club has been successful in widening it's reach as a result of this is questionable

Also the ECB requirement for flatter pitches and subsequently counties needing faster seamers especially in Div 1 could be what has done for Milo. He'd have likely taken buckets of wickets this April but we've signed Hassan so we aren't gonna not play him are we?

Josh Davey has had to drop down to Div 2 to get a game this week maybe Milo can too I'd like to think he's good enough to eke out wickets for Derbyshire or the like. Bazball effect perhaps also having an influence. Milo needs 10-15 overs sustained pressure to extract a wicket or two whereas Rushworth OHD Hassan etc... can do that in 5 or 6

Milo would've been a great bowler for Worcestershire e.g. in the late 80's not quite as stocky as Phil Newport but that style

We play away at Notts on June 11th.

I look at it this way. At the members forum last year several attendees requested more weekend cricket. Having this Blast Off means that we get to play our Blast opener on a Saturday rather than the middle of next week like the other 14 counties. Certain counties only want 5 home Blast games going forward and they want them on Fridays, Saturday's and Sundays - Lancs, Yorks, Derby (clearly) and I know Durham and Warks would prefer fewer Blast games than the 7 they stage currently. Some of the southern counties want the opposite e.g. Somerset Essex with their smaller grounds that are easily filled even in midweek would like to keep 7 Blast home games or even increase that number.

This looks like a fudge and I know many feel it detracts from the County Championship having this Blast Off while it's still going on but I do think maybe naively on my part it has been set up with the best of intentions.

Also gives the broadcaster Sky two games to show for the price of one production set up fee and the ECB can use it to LAUNCH the Blast.

Sky are scaling down their Blast coverage I think this was hinted at last season. Some of their games their commentary team will do it remotely as in they won't be at the ground just use the YouTube and fixed camera feed. I was hoping they'd keep Blast Fridays and have CC games Sunday to Wednesday. That way Sky could have a Jeff Stelling type programme Friday Night Cricket following all the games with the likes of Darren Maddy and Trotty in the studio discussing all 7 or 8 games (you'd still have one London game on the Thursday)

I actually like that they're trying to resurrect bthe Blast Group stages after the ECB have spent the last 3 seasons decking it up. Finals Day is still superb but to me the group stages and even last years quarter final were awful. Also if and when the Hundred gets binned off this will show there is scope within the existing 18 county set up for events to draw in crowds of 16-17'000 that previously Lancs only get for their roses clash and Bears only ever get when we play the Pears

But admittedly it does look messy and perhaps given a big Ashes series is coming up there ought have been another round of CC cricket in early June to give the IPL returnees who've hardly played for three months some time in the middle

There was a fair bit of needle in this match never going over the top mind. Jamie Porter psyching himself up as he gathered himself to run in and bowl. Thought the Burgess feather through to the keeper looked like it might have dropped short too and there were a few questionable lbw decisions. Then there was Snater giving OHD a very vocal send off more in frustration at himself than anything untoward. And Hassan I'd agree man of the match alongside Rushworth and Rhodes. Three (possibly four?) dropped catches so unlike us this season could've had this settled before the luncheon interval had they stuck.

Wonder if we've now established the kind of rivalry with Essex we had with Kent in the 1990's
Champion side pre-COVID being knocked off their perch somewhat

Rushworth was always a solid signing for me. There are no guarantees but he was always more likely to continue being one of the country's top 3 or 4 wicket taking seamers of the last 12 years than struggle here. He's still bowling a sequence of deliveries whether it's in Div 1, 2 or test level he'd do a similar job.

It's as good a signing for me as Hampshire picking up Keith Barker four years ago. Quite unusual for us to get a bowler with such a pedigree as we've become accustomed to obtaining rough diamonds to fashion from Wright, Rankin through to Norwell and Miles bowlers making their way

The question I'm left pondering is are batting sides now as good as they were when he was last in Division 1 before the ECB demoted them in 2016? Also how will Warks attack look in mid-season if/when we have a drier spell with less seam friendly conditions. Norwell, Brookes come into the equation?

Think they won't play Jimmy against Ireland. He's had a decent run of games in the CC now looked primed this morning with 2 for 5 off his 8 over spell. Possibly only one of Broad and Robinson will play too. So Woakes probably will play against Ireland along with anyone else who's short of bowling time returning from the IPL maybe even Sam Curran or one of the Overton's

Andy wrote:

Do we think Woakes play at Lords no matter what due to his exceptional Test record on that ground?
Possibly but I think it'll be more to do with availability of others and the conditions in the week leading up to the game. Stokes will want Lord's to be the harder and flatter than normal as he's said he want those wickets. Big gamble that I think but it's bold. Chances of that type of wicket being able to be produced at Lord's if the weather played ball they've got the resources to produce such a pitch.

Rainy week and Broad needing a rest perhaps it is when Woakes comes in but not if conditions dictate we need to bring Wood in or extra bounce of Potts say.

Was probably the edict all the way along from on high for him to play a certain number of first class matches. Remember the 2021 title win having to beg ECB to allow him to play that second game versus Somerset. I'm guessing we haven't felt the need to invoke that option this time with Hassan having had his rest week and with us having Barnard to bowl Woakes-lite spells and maybe even Rhodes is fit enough to turn his arm over if a partnership is needed to be broken and maybe wanting to utilise ohd to open the bowling with Rushworth

Woakes will almost certainly be in the squad for that test v Ireland and they'll have him ready to step in in case Jimmy Broad or Robinson aren't available for Edgbaston and as a rotation option for rest of the series

The Warwick pool that kept Essex or was it Surrey? afloat in the 1970's? Or helped rebuild crumbling Oval or Chelmsford at that time?

We do seem to like trialling left arm seamers ever since we let a mighty fine one go 😢
This Josh Croom sounds interesting though.
Top scored in the Southern version of the B'ham league last season for South Wiltshire. Berkswell have picked him up this season although as we all know theres been hardly any club cricket played yet and he's spent winters in Glenelg in Adelaide

The upgrades to the squad have been substantial over the last two seasons. Sure Davies didn't come off really last season but he was brought in at a time where it was possible Sibley would have already moved back to Surrey which was the rumour towards the end of the title win so he needed replacing. Not saying Davies is better than Sibley but a different style of player that would help us accrue a greater haul of batting bonus points in the long run. They dispensed with overseas batting after Vihari and Malan found it tricky in April in England Hassan instead comes in and instantly effects games. Chance then arises to give extended runs in the team to Mousley and eventually perhaps Bethell and Benjamin alongside the experience of Rhodes and Hain. Rhodes is now getting towards what Bresnan was in 2021 in terms of experience. Sure he needs a score even a scratchy 70 or 80 would be brilliant from him but his game nous will have grown over the past four seasons now. Keeping Burgess happy is crucial and having Woakes available even if it ends up being for just this phase of the season is an added bonus.

Barnard is the upgrade on Lamb/Milo where we get two players in one and also the replacement for Bresnan we never had last season to an extent.

Rushworth rather than a dozen or so who've been tried since COVID is a massive upgrade. On top.of all his own attributes it ought to mean we can utilize Danny Briggs more effectively this season. He's not just gonna be thrown the ball in desperation like Jeetan Patel often was towards the end of his stint because the seam attack was so pop-gun. Briggs will chip in with the bat like always and be used in an attacking role more and help make up for the lack of true pace in the side to blow away tails unless we get Norwell back or Henry Brookes gets on one of his Broad-like spells

GerryShedd wrote:

Still top of the table now that the other matches are finished:
https://www.espncricinfo.com/series/county-championship-division-one-2023-1347099/points-table-standings
Rob Yates may have been a bit in and out with his batting so far but he seems able to catch anything at first slip.

ESPN tables are always a bit unreliable.
We're joint top with Surrey both on 60 points. Ten ahead of third placed Essex.

One ghost we're slowly laying to rest is this assumption we're quite a cautious, even negative dour side David Hopps for instance has banged on about it for three seasons and the Somerset commentators were for whatever reason incredulous that we didn't try to smack it about on day three and pull out early on that last day and set up some kind of contest and bring Somerset into the game.

Today we're the only side that has pushed the boat out and won. All 7 other fixtures this weekend have been draws

So to add to our ability to keep games alive like we did so often in the title winning season 2021 we now have in our locker an attack that can bust games wide open and beat teams by innings

Back top of the league (for a couple of hours at least)

If Surrey was a reality check (Suggestion after that thumping was that Warks were unlikely to finish 1st, 2nd or 3rd) has this thrown cat amongst the pigeons again???